Comparison of 6 Tesla Batteries Versus 12 Yellow Top Batteries
The total pack voltage is approximately the same at 144 volts.
Weight of the 6 Tesla batteries is about 330 pounds compared to 717.6 pounds for the 12 Yellow Top 8050-160-FFP-D31T batteries.
The 6 Tesla batteries should provide 31.8 kWh and it is anticipated that about 80% of the contained energy will be available for use. The 12 Yellow Tops provide about 10.8 kWh of which about 50% of the contained energy is expected to be available. It is estimated that this 1992 325i EV conversion requires about 400 watt-h for each mile travelled, then the Tesla batteries should allow for a range of about 63.6 miles compared to the Yellow Tops expected range of 13.5 miles.
Upon arrival the modules measured between 23.09 and 23.12 volts. These batteries were extracted from a 2015 Tesla Model S (vin 5YJSA4H29FFP74017) which originally used a 85 kWh pack. The VIN can be decoded here: https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/decoding-tesla-model-s-vins.7638/
Each battery module is labeled with a sticker that indicates both a part number and a serial number. All of the batteries received were part number (P) TPN 1009312-00-E. The following serial numbers and corresponding module voltages were recorded:
Tesla Batteries Ability to Hold Charge
12/7/2016 1/29/18 1/26/19 5/25/20
(S) TSN T14G824536 23.09 volts 23.07 volts (-0.09%) 23.03 volts (-0.17%) 22.86 volts (-0.74%)
(S) TSN T14G824283 23.11 volts 22.29 volts * (-3.55%) 21.74 volts * (-2.47%) 21.60 volts* (-0.64%
(S) TSN T14G824610 23.11 volts 23.10 volts (-0.04%) 23.07 volts (-0.13%) 23.07 volts (0.00%)
(S) TSN T14G824617 23.12 volts 23.08 volts (-0.17%) 23.03 volts (-.022%) 22.81 volts (-0.96%)
(S) TSN T14G824692 23.12 volts 23.09 volts (-0.13%) 23.06 volts (-0.13%) 23.05 volts (-0.04%)
(S) TSN T14G824708 23.12 volts 22.30 volts * (-3.55%) 21.76 volts * (-2.42%) 21.72 volts* (-0.18%)
Updated 1/29/18; 1/26/19; 5/25/20
6/14/2021 compared to voltage on 12/7/2016
(S) TSN T14G824536 22.7 volts (-0.39 volts, or -1.69% from 12/7/2016)
(S) TSN T14G824283 15.6 volts * ouch
(S) TSN T14G824610 22.8 volt (-0.31 volts, or -1.34% since 12/7/2016)
(S) TSN T14G824617 22.5 volts (-0.62 volts, or -2.68% since 12/7/2016)
(S) TSN T14G824692 22.8 volts (-0.32 volts, or -1.38% since 12/7/2016)
(S) TSN T14G824708 21.5 volts *
Updated 6/14/21
Note that over the period of 12/7/16 to 5/25/20 (1265 days) the average loss in voltage for the six batteries amounted -2.567% per battery over a 1265 day (3.518 years) period. This is a loss of about 0.73% of the original voltage level per year.
Updated 5/25/20, 6/14/21
Updated 5/25/20, 6/14/21
If we ignore the two batteries that were damaged, the average voltage of the remaining 4 batteries is 22.7 volts. The average voltage of the same four batteries on 12/7/2016 was 23.11 volts. This represents an average change of -0.41 volts (-1.77%) over a 1650 day period (4.521 years).
Updated 6/14/21
Updated 6/14/21
* These two batteries were installed in the battery box and briefly shorted with a socket wrench (blog entry 6/18/17, picture DSC05985). The other four batteries have never had a load placed on them. Note that the voltages suggest essentially no leakage during 13 months of storage.
This will probably be the end of the long term stability test for the batteries and the installation of the Orion BMS will now begin.
Updated 5/25/2020
Picture DSC05178. After removing the orange rubber terminal protectors on the left, this module (serial # 4610) was found to be partially charged and 23.11 volts. The terminal landing areas (Picture DSC05298 ) under the orange plugs are 37 mm x 37 mm with a M8 x 27 mm center bolt.
Picture DSC05298 of the low voltage terminal (left side when viewed from the top) after removal of the orange cover.
Updated 5/13/18
Picture DSC05176. Each battery module has a BMS control PC board located at one end. The yellow tape (one at the left and two at right) secure the top and bottom plastic vacuform type covers to the module. The tape appears to be a Polyamideimide tape (likely Kapton, see https://www.uline.com/BL_6407/Kapton-Tape?pricode=WE491&AdKeyword=kapton%20tape&AdMatchtype=e&gclid=CPWO2_v4y9ACFZA2aQod4YMFgQ&gclsrc=aw.ds )
Picture DSC05191 After removal of the four black mounting pins the control board can be pulled away from the module to reveal a pair of white connectors. The white left 15 pin connector is used to measure the voltage of six battery subgroups of cells. The right connector with pairs of blue and yellow wires are connected to temperature probes. The white connectors can each be removed by first pressing the top center tab (corrected 4/28/17) and gently prying upward while pulling on the connector. The Gold surfaces at the top of the picture are the tape covered bent ends of the module's heating/cooling coils.
Picture DSC05196 showing the four wires that travel on the top of the pack (black, red, yellow, and blue) and the three wires on the bottom of the module (green, blown and orange). Each of the wires is connected to a different region of the battery surface (Picture DSC05186) and provide different voltage measurements (see below).
Picture DSC05186 showing one of the wires that is welded to a region of the metal face plate.
Picture DSC05192 showing a close up of the right side temperature sensor (TS) which is connected to the BMS board with a pair of blue wires. The left side (yellow wires) temperature sensor measured 13.74 k ohms and the blue sensor wires measured 13.79 k ohms.
A Klein Tools CL2000 digital Voltmeter was used for all measurements. The CL2000 can measure up to 1000 volts DC and up to 400 amps DC. The following voltages were measured from Left Terminal (when viewed from the top with the bms board close to the viewer ) of a battery (serial # 4610) to each of the sensor wires:
Cell 6 - blue - 23.10 volts
Cell 4 - yellow - 15.40 volts
Cell 2 - red - 7.70 volts
Cell 0 - black - 0.00 volts
Cell 1 - brown - 3.86 volts
Cell 3 - orange - 11.55 volts
Cell 5 - green - 19.26 volts
Voltage between Left Terminal (-) to Right Terminal (+) = 23.1 volts
Updated 1/29/18
Updated 5/13/18
The pack is considered to be 0% State of Charge (SOC) when the module measures 18.6 volts. A 70% charge typically measures 23.1 volts, and a 100% charge is about 24.9 volts.
DSC05180 showing the side of the module opposite to the electrical control side. Each coolant line was shipped sealed with black caps to prevent residual coolant from leaking out during shipment. The three gold regions are the Kapton covered u-bends of the serpentine cooling tubes that make 8 lengthwise passes through the battery pack. Note that the vertical positions of the nipples are different. The left side (input) is lower than the right side (output).
Picture DSC05232 showing a close up of the 5/16" coolant nipple after the black cap was removed.
The cooling loop uses a pair of 5/16" (ID) tubing nipples that appeared to a Dorman 800-080 or 800-120 type Fuel Line Quick Connector. Although these connectors were tested both bottomed out when installed and neither snapped tight as anticipated. Although one can probably install straight tubing with hose clamps, we are still looking to source the correct couplings.
Details of Dorman connectors can be found here: http://www.dormanproducts.com/gsearch.aspx?type=keyword&origin=keyword&q=fuel+line+connector . These connectors can also be purchased (Dorman, ebay.com and Amazon.com) and they are available for different tubing sizes, as straight, 45 degree and 90 degree angled fittings.
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UPDATED 12-19-2016
It was found that Dorman 800-116 Fuel Line Connectors (Summit Racing, part RNB-800-116, at $7.97 per pair) appear to work very well. These fittings are described as 5/16" Steel to 5/16" (8 mm) Nylon Straight and the connectors snap on tightly yet can still be removed easily by pressing the tab located on the side.
Picture DSC05324 of the Dorman 800-116 connector after one was snapped onto the Tesla battery cooling fitting. Some pale blue coolant fluid spilled out during the effort.
Picture DSC05325 close up of both sides of the fitting. Release tab is evident on left side of the bottom fitting.
Picture DSC05327 of the blue colored fluid that was recovered from the module. In one of Tesla's battery patents ( http://www.google.com/patents/US20140178722 ) this fluid is described only as " water or another coolant, such as any conventional anti-freeze mixed with water, oil, or even cold air ". The blue color suggests that the fluid is Propylene glycol, but time permitting, this fluid will later be tested for both concentration and identity.
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Picture DSC05287: Each Tesla battery module has a "fin" on each side which extends the majority of the length of the module. When looking at the modules from the battery terminal end, the right side "fin" has a maximum width of 0.5" (top unit, the rounded section with 7/32" holes) and the remainder of the "fin" is 5/16". The left side "fin" has a width of 0.375" (bottom unit). These fins will be used to support the modules in a Mounting Frame that is being constructed that will support 4 batteries. The Mounting Frame will then be isolated within a Stainless Steel battery box, and the battery box finally placed within the trunk located wheel well of the 325i.
Picture DSC05230 showing close up of the rear portion of the left hand rail (or "fin") that is 0.375" wide and 0.125" thick.
Can you tell me what the spacing is between the batteries (X & Y)?
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